John the Conqueror and The Goddess Oya with Mawyiah Kai El-Jamah

Mawiyah

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[00:00:00] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Hello everybody and welcome to Dine with the Divine. I'm your host Ashley and together we're going to be exploring the magical, the

[00:00:11] mystical, and everything in between

[00:00:14] On today's episode

[00:00:15] we're going to talk about John the Conqueror and the goddess Oya. I hope everybody's having a great week and if not, I hope it gets better soon. So today's guest is Mawiyakai L. And she is an award winning writer, educator, and spirit woman. Mauia is an eighth generation witch, igun medium, and priestess of Oya in the Yoruba system of spirituality. Mauia's writings have appeared in Thicker Than Water, The Crab Orchard Review, Beyond the Frontier, Family Portraits, African Voices, and Essence magazines.

[00:00:55] Ooh, so fancy. Mauia is the host. of Fish Head in Red [00:01:00] Gravy, a podcast dedicated to celebrating marginalized people of the esoteric and occult world. And Maui is the author of the newly released Conjuring the Calabash, Empowering Women with Hoodoo Spells and Magic, published by Llewellyn O'Connor.

[00:01:14] worldwide. And these days, Mawiyo may be working on her middle grade series titled the Cool Beans Ghost Hunter Society, exploring the inclusiveness of the special needs human superhuman teens. Oh, I love that. Or hosting the podcast Fish Heads in Red Gravy dedicated to celebrating marginalized black and brown people of the esoteric and occult world.

[00:01:36] Mawiyo, how are you doing today?

[00:01:39] Mawiyah: great. How are you doing? so be here.

[00:01:41] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: well. Oh, I'm so happy. I'm so happy. As I asked mostly everybody, how did your kind of spiritual, I mean, well, I see, like you said, you're an eighth generation, which, but how did it start for you? When did you get into everything? And how did, yeah, how did that go?

[00:01:59] Mawiyah: Well, when I [00:02:00] was young, probably about five or six years old, I could see spirits. And my mom, who also could see spirits at an early age, we were born with the veil of skin over our eyes. We call it a call. She, helped me out with all of that. It wasn't like, Oh, don't talk about that.

[00:02:17] Track 1: It was okay. Let's process it. I see them too. And I knew that eventually you would. And so she talked me through, how to have my own time, how to help them out, but also still remain a child, very much a child. Definitely don't go to school and tell, cause I was in Catholic school.

[00:02:31] Don't tell the nuns that, that out. But yeah. She was into tarot. She was into astrology. And so it was much easier. And, growing up in New Orleans, there's a lot of voodoo culture. There's lots of Santeria, the big mixture of everything. And so I think for me, and like a lot of people, it was very easy to, fall into that path.

[00:02:51] Nobody was saying, we need to rush you to a priest or anything like that. It was really understandable and nurturing. And like I say, at that early age, I could see them [00:03:00] and in the house we lived it was always a lot of I guess people, the way I recognize it now, who didn't make it quite make it to the Underground Railroad.

[00:03:08] So it was that kind of energy that was still residual in the home.

[00:03:12] And so it was this passing of information, like, can you tell, my, my relatives or whatever, that I'm still here, that I'm trying to get to them, that kind of energy it was. And yeah, so from a very early age, it was really just listening and being a voice for them as, as much as I could and helping them pass on as much as I could with my mother.

[00:03:34] Ashley: Wow. Okay. So you literally were like a psychopomp from when you were

[00:03:38] Track 1: Yeah.

[00:03:38] Ashley: kid. That's awesome. As you grew older, and I just asked this question because I find that well for you, it may be completely different because you're, the way you grew up is very accepting and that's awesome.

[00:03:49] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: A lot of people sometimes have like a dip in their like spiritual path where they're just like you're like a teenager, a young adult. You're eh, I don't care about this so much right now. I just want to be cool. Yeah.

[00:03:59] And then you come [00:04:00] back to that. Did that ever happen to you or did it stay strong the whole time?

[00:04:04] Track 1: It was still there. I still wanted to, like you just want to experience things that teenagers do, right? We want to listen to our music and want to have fun. So it was a lot of of doing that because I learned early how to turn it off, not accept it for this period of time.

[00:04:18] Throughout a lot of my high school years, it was that, I really wanted to fit in, I wanted to hang out with the other girls, the cool girls and things like that. It was a lot of just me putting up that wall for it for that period of time. When I got closer to graduating high school, I saw that I needed to pull back to that information, that energy, because we always lived near graveyards, and so that's that, oh, yeah, energy we talk about, and so it was just this pull to remember to go back to this source for future for my future.

[00:04:49] And I see, it coming full circle now. So I think for me, turning it off for a bit just to try to have a teenage life and then going back to it. Yeah, I did experience that, but [00:05:00] it wasn't. I don't think for me, it wasn't so much of, I felt like a weird kid,

[00:05:04] but growing up, I really felt like, like a superhero, like you have something that somebody else really doesn't have, but because it was nurtured, it wasn't that I had to hide it, and so I felt like it was an extra something, that I had, but I still wanted, like you're any kid, you still want to be, to do those things, those fun things, Later on, growing up, like, like I say, high school, 12th grade, it was that urgency to get back involved in it to understand, what lessons am I supposed to learn for my future as an adult?

[00:05:33] Ashley: Okay Interesting. All right. So then you Obviously you write and you write for a lot of these different magazines, which is really awesome like really popular magazines I'm so impressed Like wow, you're like so cool Beyond writing your book. So you wrote this book Conjuring the Calabash and it's all about empowering women with hoodoo spirits Magic what [00:06:00] inspired you to put that book out?

[00:06:01] Yeah

[00:06:09] Mawiyah: lot to just do. Talk to other people, about going on in your life.

[00:06:12] And it felt like, like I watch stuff on TV, but I didn't want to be that involved with other lives. Like what? But when I started doing it, I found that people really were receptive and they felt like, it was really helping them. So then the pandemic happens, right?

[00:06:28] And you have a lot of people who are feeling like, I can't go to church. I don't know what to do, and a lot of women were really feeling that way, too, where they were at home with the kids and, other things. And they just really, they didn't see a sense of purpose for themselves.

[00:06:41] And so I would, I had a lot more clients who were not in the spiritual realm, they were more, Catholic or Baptist, but they were like, somebody told me about you, kind of thing. Like, I just to, no, I'm not, I want to see, so the more I started to work with them, they would tell their friends and tell, and so I would just, I would ask, is it okay if I kind of jot down, what we've talked about, in [00:07:00] terms of how this might help other people.

[00:07:02] And so that's what kind of formulated the book, just from those conversations with people and then thinking about my own background and how growing up in it, it's really different than, somebody coming to you and trying to figure out how it would impact their own lives.

[00:07:16] Track 1: And so it was a lot of explaining to people that, it's not something scary, nobody's going to put on a black robe and march you around into a room nude, things like that. When you see on television, I'm like, This is really it's spirituality. It's being one with the universe.

[00:07:30] And it's allowing you to see that you don't need a building, to shape your ideas of God or your connection to God or goddess or whatever type of energy. And so for a lot of them, it was just. Opening up to something new and something that allows them to go to their pantry and pull things from, to really feel good about themselves and to empower themselves.

[00:07:51] And I always leave them with the fact that you're your own minister. You can be in control of those things for your own personal life. So that's where the book came from. [00:08:00] And the more women were coming back and saying, I feel the shift in my life.

[00:08:05] I thought that it should be shared. Just thinking then about how do we get it out there?

[00:08:09] When we're talking about black and brown people, right? How do we get it out there? And a lot of people were like, we have white people that have already said this stuff. Why do we need a black person to do it? And I'm saying, well, because it's a black practice, right?

[00:08:23] But we need black people to talk about black things.

[00:08:26] Not some, yeah, not some

[00:08:28] AI generated black person that you create, because, as I did my own research, I would find, that there were people who were not real people, and yeah, and it was just this whole need to constantly say, no, they need to see this. And then it was this idea, well, do black women buy books?

[00:08:46] And I'm like, what?

[00:08:47] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: What? Okay.

[00:08:48] Track 1: Yeah, you won't believe the stuff I heard. And it was just proving to people that we do want our stories, we will go to those sections in the bookstore, the metaphysical sections, but [00:09:00] we when we go, oftentimes we're like piecing together.

[00:09:03] Other people's, story to try to make it fit into our little black worlds, and it's difficult. It's really difficult. And it's easier if we find someone who looks like us, who knows our story, knows our past, it will intertwine that into what we're doing into our magic. And so that's what I really had to experience.

[00:09:20] Express to anybody when I was trying to send it out, workshop it or whatever that we really want to see ourselves and it's hard for us, a lot of black women were coming saying, in the workplace, I'm just as educated as the next person. The white woman, the white man. And I get, shitted on, basically right.

[00:09:38] If I mess up,

[00:09:40] why did we hire you? That's the mentality, right? Why do we hire you? You're so dumb, it's like you, you were just freed yesterday and you can't get this work done, but if a white lady messes up, a white woman, it's usually, oh, it's a blonde moment and it's laughed off, and so it's a lot of that kind of stuff. Stuff that I really felt like I needed to have in the book to [00:10:00] give us that, I got to get up today. I got to fight this and move on. And yeah, I tried to break the book up and workings that were easier for people to do. And I didn't want anybody to feel turned off if they were not initiated to a path.

[00:10:14] Cause it's not about that. It's about really understanding the magic and that magic doesn't really need require those kinds of things. It just requires our acceptance.

[00:10:24] Ashley: Oh my god, you said so much. Oh god. I'm so thank you. I love I was just actually telling somebody the other day like my friend who is white and explained to her that like I literally And this is my whole life and I feel like a lot of black and brown people We do unconsciously do so many things that when we explain it to people who aren't brown or black They're like what why would you do that?

[00:10:48] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: You're like i'm like, oh when I walk up to people I just expect them to think that I don't know what I'm talking about or that I'm dumb. And she's like, why? I was like, cause that's just how it is. And [00:11:00] she's

[00:11:00] like, why? I'm like, I don't know.

[00:11:03] Track 1: Same here, when I talk to people, my co workers or my friends who are white, and it's like, it's well, why are you, why, because you really start to second guess what you're about to say. The words that are going to come out of my mouth, I really have to replay it, right?

[00:11:15] Because you're thinking to yourself, I know when this comes out, there's going to be questions. Somebody's going to look like, really? And you want to go back and sort of Google on the side if there's something you don't understand because you don't want them to think, well, what's wrong with her?

[00:11:27] Why doesn't she know this? And so it's always that. And they and, and I will say to them, well, you don't have to do that.

[00:11:33] And even when you walk into a room, there is this whole aura, this whole presence, you're thinking everybody's looking to see where is she going?

[00:11:40] What is she going to do? Yeah. And that's something that they never have to experience, and so I tried in the with the book to have workings where it empowered us to the point that when we do walk into a room, we're able to get that energy to feel that energy and to be like, I belong here, even if we don't say it, just to have that reassurance that it's okay.[00:12:00]

[00:12:00] It's okay. If you're the only one there, then you're going to shine like the only one there,

[00:12:04] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: I love that because I was just saying the other day. I think I put it on threads I was like I need to walk around with the confidence of a cishet white man because like

[00:12:13] cisgendered heterosexual white men They just like walk in anywhere and they're like I need this done and people are like, yes, sir, and i'm like, how does this happen?

[00:12:20] Exactly

[00:12:28] Track 1: and the guys dancing, they're like, look at him. He's like, he's a gay guy, but he's white. And he's like Oh, he's just walking around in the room and everybody's looking, but he doesn't care.

[00:12:36] He's got his head on and his little hip hunkers his thing. And yeah. You want to be able to walk around with that kind of energy because, It's just, it doesn't matter where you go, but if you, it could be to work, it could be to a restaurant, it could be McDonald's, you walk there and you're the only one and you're like, Oh my God, they're all looking, you know what I'm saying?

[00:12:54] If I do something, anything wrong, it's going to be, so [00:13:00] yeah, I, and I took that into account with the the smaller workings, like they're called Juju on the fly. And the juju on the fly workings are things that you can do about, take about five minutes before you leave for work or wherever you're going.

[00:13:12] And they give you that extra push to just navigate through the day and navigate through, whatever you have to do, and things like that. So even that, and with the Glamour Magic for example, for us, making sure we say our mantra and we look in that mirror and we're just, we're just, you're so fly and, laying out our clothes the night before and putting crystals on there, just to give us that extra push to say, I have it, I got it.

[00:13:34] I got to have everything I need. And even with the book, there's a playlist on Spotify. So those songs too will help, and they're not like, you think like Gregorian chants or anything like

[00:13:44] It's popular music for us, right? And there's something on there we can find, there's even meditation, things like that, but there's a lot of music that we can just, groove to and still be in that headspace of magic.

[00:13:57] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yes. Oh my god. I love that So [00:14:00] I want to ask you How has for you? So you do you still live in new orleans? Are you in that area?

[00:14:09] Track 1: I still live, we live in Louisiana after Katrina, we moved to the northern part of Louisiana.

[00:14:14] We had little kids and we needed to get them back in school and stuff like that, but we go, we still go back and forth. My family's still there. And Yeah so it's a lot of traveling back and forth because, we miss it.

[00:14:25] My husband and I, both are from New Orleans, so we're like, ah, we can't stay away forever. Yeah. Huh.

[00:14:30] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Find that?

[00:14:31] Track 1: Huh.

[00:14:32] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: I live up north and it's a different situation. I know, like when it comes, it's like up here when it comes to IFA or Santeria, it's usually like Hispanic communities, people who are Puerto Rican or Dominican practicing it. So you don't find a ton of, like, well, there are African, Latino and Latinx people, but My experience so far, when I know people from the south, when you bring [00:15:00] up, like, IFA, Santeria, ATRs, DTRs, they're very much, like, a lot of them, not everybody, now it's, I feel like it's a lot better, but I feel like before, people are like, oh my god, that's so bad, that's so bad, don't ever talk about that, oh my god, that's so

[00:15:13] bad, and you're like, But like these are like I feel like people

[00:15:18] in the south are like you guys are there like your ancestors are there

[00:15:22] with you I'm like embrace that so do you have you seen like people receive your book?

[00:15:27] Well who come from like the south?

[00:15:31] I just might yeah

[00:15:33] Track 1: I've seen people. Yes. Yes. And actually both black and white people have received it. Well, now what I have found is that I, sometimes there is a lot of talking about it at first, because even though, like we talk about with people, black and brown people, it's still that fear.

[00:15:48] So that's it. stigma because of colonization and everything. So the idea is that yeah, that's something, but we don't do that. And so what I usually do is I start talking about different things that, happen, maybe happen in your [00:16:00] home. Like, do you, have you ever heard of anybody, it could be something like covering the mirrors and they'll say, well, yeah, my grandma does that.

[00:16:06] When there's a thunderstorm or when somebody dies or whatever, and you know you talk about, that's conjure, that's voodoo, and so you get into different things that maybe an elder did or, and a lot of people remember those things, right? Well, we don't call it that, and you say, That's what it is, right?

[00:16:21] But in the same token, they'll say, well, but we go to church. I'm saying, well, a lot of times your people do,

[00:16:27] right? And they still, and that's the thing about who do you can practice Santeria, you can go to church or whatever, and still have that practice. Marie Laveau she used the cathedral to do a lot of her workings in.

[00:16:39] For a lot of people, there is still fear. And that's why with the book, I didn't want to to give it a heavy dose of, Ifa or

[00:16:45] Ashley: Yeah.

[00:16:45] Mawiyah: I wanted to introduce those elements to show the overlap in our spirituality, but I wanted people to feel like I can do this and this is something and it works, and to really come into it that way.

[00:16:57] It's like, When I was younger a lot of [00:17:00] people, girls, and they would come into African culture through African dance,

[00:17:04] Ashley: Yeah.

[00:17:05] Track 1: and then they would like to, then they would started wanting to dress and wear the head wraps and everything, and the more they learned about those things, then they wanted to learn about the spirituality element of it.

[00:17:14] And so I think that. The appreciation for who we are in our African past, the fear, I understand the fear because, if we're not colonized mentally, then, we are, we have freedom and liberation and we want to fight for those things. Who was it? Napoleon said, religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich,

[00:17:31] So as long as we are bound by religion and not spirituality, then we'll never grow.

[00:17:36] When we become more spiritual people, then we're more accepting. And so I try to talk about it that way with people when they start to look at it and go, who do, when they see that on the cover, because I've had people say that, Oh my goodness you're writing a book like that, it's going to be this, you're gonna, you're not going to make it to heaven.

[00:17:52] You're going to do this and that. And then we start to talk about, Some things that they have done in their lives, or if I'm wearing a certain Nicholas, they'll say, Oh, [00:18:00] I know that's an evil. I Nicholas, I know. And this and that, and, and then you start to talk about the overlapping and then they go, Oh, really, I didn't know that.

[00:18:08] And then they'll start to give you more information, well, in my family, we do this and we do that. So I have met that and I try to always meet it with, just with factual information, talk to the elders. Why did they need to do those things? Well, because. They didn't have people who tended to their needs, our trauma of enslavement.

[00:18:26] We didn't have doctors who were going to say, okay, let's, I'm the therapist, let's talk about you being enslaved. That didn't happen. So we had to have the root workers and the conjurers to deliver our babies, to do all of these things for us. And so this was our liberation magic. It helped us to stay sane as much as it helped us to get free.

[00:18:44] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Oh my god I have chills all over my body. That's so good. Okay But it's so true and we've talked about Different types of folk magic from all over the world on this podcast and it's exactly what you're saying people There's always somebody like oh, no, but that's [00:19:00] like a negative thing. But people are like, yeah, but remember how You your grandmother always does X, Y, and Z and they'll be like, yeah, and they'll be like, why?

[00:19:07] Like, I don't know. She just always does that.

[00:19:09] That's everyone's answer. Like, I don't know. And then it's like, well, why don't you, why do you never step on a crack? Why do you, if you cut your hair, you have to put it somewhere else and make sure nobody touches it. I don't know. My grandma always just told me to do that.

[00:19:21] And it's like, but why? And then when they

[00:19:23] figured out, they're like shocked. They're like, Oh my God.

[00:19:28] Track 1: And then you ask them, well, how did those things service grandma, did grandma look like somebody who wasn't, who was demonic, you know what I'm saying? Did she grow horns in the middle

[00:19:37] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: It's a

[00:19:37] Track 1: night? Those kinds of things. And they go, well, no, my grandmother is a sweet person.

[00:19:41] How dare you, well, because she always had something that serviced her outside of the church, right? She didn't wait till Sunday to tell everything to the preacher. Can help me. She managed her own life, her own spirituality.

[00:19:53] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah, exactly. And like, there's and like you're saying, like you said, there's so many people who do [00:20:00] spiritual practices, who some of them don't call them that they might just say, well, this is like a folk thing, or this is just what we always do. And then there's a lot of people who do it and they're the first person to get to church on Sunday and the last one to leave and they go to every Bible study.

[00:20:13] It doesn't mean anything different. But it's just. through millennia, like you said,

[00:20:19] in every place in the world. It's just how people dealt with stuff. No matter where you come from, some people somewhere have probably been conquered. And then, in the case of African American people were enslaved and they were like, well, how are we going to get through the day?

[00:20:36] Cause this fucking sucks.

[00:20:37] Track 1: Right. You take the word hoodoo as I've been taught and itself, if people get scared of it, but the word itself is about who did what

[00:20:46] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah.

[00:20:47] Track 1: Into who do and so when you say that to somebody or somebody says that this person has been who do the,

[00:20:52] goal is to find out, well, what is the witness?

[00:20:55] What is the tag lock or the thing that's that they used to do this to you? Why [00:21:00] is this happening? So there's a whole process like when you go to the doctor, right? I'm my hip is, bothering me, There's a whole process you have to go through to find out, what's wrong and how we're going to cure it.

[00:21:10] And so who do is just that intricate. And so for a lot of people as well. You think about those folk magic practices, especially for black and brown people, we don't really get to it's not really thought of as high magic as, as much as western magic is. And so I think that when we talk about it, black and brown people talk about it.

[00:21:28] It's oh, it's that thing that they do, but somebody else takes it on and it's like, oh, well, it's this great thing now. And so to. And that also, I think for a lot of people, it shuns them away from wanting to do it. It makes them feel like, Oh, that's just, that's not really magic.

[00:21:44] I don't want that book. I want the book on Wicca. I want, I want this other thing, but we have to start looking at the beauty of our own practices and why they were necessary. And then, how they're overlaid with Native American practices. Africans coming from all different places.

[00:21:58] And so you have the Native American [00:22:00] influence. You have whatever's there with the Western influence that's already there. And then you have all of the different African regions coming together to actually, make sure that this gumbo of people. Magic, is sustainable for everyone to understand.

[00:22:13] And so that in itself, when you study the history of it, it makes it a beautiful process, and I think that for a lot of people, who want to study magic, they have to really see that this has a place too, just like all of those other practices that have lots of books on the shelves, This has a place to because, for a lot of us, we get turned off.

[00:22:32] We want the most expensive pair of jeans, right? We want the most expensive jacket. If it's cheaper, but it looks like it's a good quality, we still go, I don't want that. It doesn't cost a lot. And so that's the way we go into our magic. Has it been there long? How many books are on the show?

[00:22:46] I don't want to buy that. And so we start to move away from it. But this is what has really sustained us. And we need to, and we need to go back to it.

[00:22:55] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: huh. Oh 100 percent and it's like I don't like to use the word [00:23:00] easy because I feel like when people say easy it makes it sound like Cheap and that's not what

[00:23:04] Just means that

[00:23:04] it's accessible

[00:23:06] People and again, not just African Americans or Africans or Caribbeans, but people who are common folk, most of us come from common folk, right?

[00:23:15] Common ass people. Like, so they, yeah, they had what they had. It was, they couldn't, yeah. If they had eggshells because they had eggs and they had flour. Yeah. And they had certain herbs because they grew it or it was just easy to get and it was cheap. So yeah. They couldn't always go buy the most expensive waters and perfume.

[00:23:35] No, they just had

[00:23:36] it. Yeah.

[00:23:37] Track 1: And think about it. If you're on the run, if you're, if you were an enslaved person and you're on the run, you don't have time to look for the, Oh, I don't want that herb. Let me go over here. You have to pick up what you can grab,

[00:23:47] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Exactly.

[00:23:48] Track 1: And so we bring that into modern day and I, and that's what a lot of women are saying about the book is that, it's just, Stuff I already have, and I say, well, I don't want you to have to run out to the fancy metaphysical shop [00:24:00] unless you want to, I want you to be able to use what you have.

[00:24:03] Okay. Some working, work great with different color candles, but if all you have is a white candle, use it. It's about your intention. It's about how much you connect with the magic. And I tell people, you have to be magical every day. If you want your magic to have any kind of efficacy every day.

[00:24:18] And so that doesn't mean get a black robe out and start marching around the house, things like that every day. But what it means is if you get up to fix your coffee. You might say something over your coffee. You may say something over it for everyone in the home. You're getting ready to take a bath.

[00:24:32] You may whisper a prayer into your water. Those kind of things. And I say it's magical because think about it. If we we needed to borrow some money from my grandma.

[00:24:41] And we never talk to grandma, right? We hardly ever call her, maybe once a year. And we call her, we say, Grandma, the first thing that comes out of our mouth is, can I borrow a hundred dollars?

[00:24:48] And she's like, you don't call me, that kind of thing. You don't have this open. But the other kid who maybe calls grandma once a week, checks in, maybe goes to visit, they call. They could ask for five hundred. Grandma's like, come on [00:25:00] over. There's that open line of communication.

[00:25:02] And that has to happen also with our magic. And so every day, if we're working to be magical people, we're transforming our lives. One thing that I told a sister once she was having trouble with the boss. And I said, get up in the morning, get your cast iron skillet out. She said she had one from grandma, put some water in it, let it boil, write that person's name down nine times on a brown piece of brown paper bag, and say over that what you want to happen in terms of them leaving you alone.

[00:25:28] Now we're not talking about ending them, but we're talking about possibly, maybe that person can get a promotion somewhere over across town, and leave with Face. And so she did that. I said, we're gonna, you're gonna work it, you're gonna work it every day for nine days, then you're gonna, you know you're gonna redo it at the end of the day, at the end of that session, after the water's ball all boiled out, toss it in the trash, get another strip, do it again.

[00:25:50] And so within a month, that person was moved from that job and she had a more pleasant space. But I told her, I said. In addition to all that, remember how you've been working magic every day? [00:26:00] You get up in the morning and in her coffee she would say things about how she was going to have a great day, how nobody was supposed to be able to offend her or hurt her or cause her any, and that's working the magic.

[00:26:11] And so that made her magic work for her when it was time for her dire need of magic.

[00:26:16] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yes, ah, that's exactly, that's so poignant. I think that, I think it's so important for people to know that. Because a lot of people, like you were talking about before, like, It's great if you can have the most expensive thing. It's great if you, there's nothing wrong with that. But, to just have that connection every day, your magic gains so much more

[00:26:38] power, so much more efficacy, I'll say, just by like, and my like, and to me, I'm like, if somebody's like, well, how can I engage every day? Like literally the most simple way, like one of them is the way you just said, speaking it into existence. And even just like, Prayer. If you like to

[00:26:57] pray, if

[00:26:58] you like to talk to your deity, to your [00:27:00] creator, whomever you'd like to speak

[00:27:01] Track 1: right.

[00:27:01] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: just literally as simple as like, Hey, God, person, whatever. Thanks for letting me wake up today.

[00:27:08] We're going to have a great day.

[00:27:10] Track 1: And if you feel like you're, if you feel crazy because I've had people say, well, I'd go outside. I don't want to, take the dog for a walk and put your headphones on. Like you're having a conversation and for your prayer. You know what I'm saying? There are ways around that so you won't feel like a nut, and you can do that and then make that your everyday thing that you do.

[00:27:30] And that is still being in communion and opening the universal book. So that when you have something to be said, you need this help. I really need this. You're not cracking open a book for the first time saying, Oh, this didn't work. You know, you're not, you have the potential to make it happen.

[00:27:46] And

[00:27:46] that's what I always tell people. They say, well, it didn't work. Well, how familiar is magic with you? How familiar is the universe with you? Does it know you like grandma? We talked about that. I'll say that to them. No, I don't have time to do [00:28:00] it. Yes, you do. You do have time to do something every day on your drive to work or ride to work.

[00:28:05] You could still be saying those mantras, listening to that song and holding that image in your head of you achieving all those things that you want to achieve. That's magical, and that's how we transform our lives. We can't just do it when we think we want to. Okay, now I want it.

[00:28:20] Work for me. Do it. Make it happen. It's not gonna work that way,

[00:28:24] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Exactly and I always tell people No matter how hard it is you want to keep working towards your goal And I'm I'll be working towards something and I'm like God you see me, right? You see me I'm trying

[00:28:38] He's like girl calm down He's like relax Just keep doing it. Like, okay. Yeah, but keeping that line of communication is open and is so important. And I just think real quick before we move on, just because this has been so interesting. I was just thinking about how we did an episode a while ago. [00:29:00] With this lovely Elohim and we talked about charm bags and mojo bag. Yeah. I love him. He's so sweet. Talked about mojo bags and I was just thinking about, so when I was like reading and researching, there was a plantation, I believe in Virginia where they found like a whole bunch like in buried. And I was just thinking, man, like, cause you were talking about somebody saying like, Oh, I did this and it didn't work, but I've been thinking about, people, enslaved people having to deal with all the crap they had to deal with all day, but to make a mojo bag and, maybe the madame of the house yelled at you yesterday, but when you saw her trip that morning, you were like, ah, it worked.

[00:29:40] And like the comfort.

[00:29:41] Track 1: The comfort in those little steps of things, right? So

[00:29:44] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: The company, it's like, it didn't take. And we talked about this too. Like when I was talking to him, like, It's not that you need to use expensive stuff. Maybe she had a little rosemary here. She had a little this a little that and I don't know I'm saying it could be anybody not just a woman but like [00:30:00] the person who did it they had it and they were like this thing is gonna work cuz it's gonna bring me comfort and then The fact that magic too.

[00:30:08] It's people. Oh, it works or it doesn't work You just have to know it's gonna work and it's good. It's gonna work somehow for you.

[00:30:16] Yeah

[00:30:16] Track 1: And then you have to just leave that intent, you can't, just sit around knowing, or run it. Oh, are you going to work? I hope you work. You can't do that. Because now you're taking two steps forward, two

[00:30:26] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yes.

[00:30:27] Track 1: And you just have to just agree with the universe, make that pact, this is going to work.

[00:30:31] However it's going to work, you know what I'm saying? And just let that be, just like you said, the tripping. Yeah, that worked, because for that moment, they got that comfort in seeing her, she hit, she fell on her ass, we're good today. You know what I'm saying? They got that comfort in knowing that.

[00:30:46] And it didn't have to be that she tripped and she broke her leg and now she won't be up. Doesn't have to be all of that. It's just small comforts and we gradually work and you find lots of them so that they were constantly working it. So that's what that tells me. [00:31:00] They were constantly working it.

[00:31:01] So it was working.

[00:31:02] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah, exactly. They wouldn't keep doing it if it wasn't

[00:31:06] working. I

[00:31:06] Track 1: It was worth it. It was worth it. So yeah. And that's what I, I want people to understand. Also, that's, I'm glad you brought that up because oftentimes people, when they get scared of the, any ATRs, they start to think the first thing they want to throw out is the whole thing about killing people and that kind of thing, or possession and all that kind of stuff.

[00:31:24] And I want people to understand sometimes the transformation of life is minor things, right? Just moving that person to another building or another place. Across town so I can have kids, those kinds of things are things that we always encourage people to think about because a lot of times, even if they're not within this culture and they come from the church background, that's the first thing they want to say, Oh, can you kill that bitch?

[00:31:45] Or whatever.

[00:31:46] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: you're like, wait a minute.

[00:31:49] Track 1: Now tell me what's going on.

[00:31:51] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: know,

[00:31:51] Track 1: We're trying to get, cause that's what they, that's their perception of what we do.

[00:31:55] Ashley: Yes. Yes.

[00:31:57] Mawiyah: And so I walked them through, the fact that we have [00:32:00] things that we don't do either, right? you're supposed to have things that you

[00:32:03] Ashley: Yeah,

[00:32:09] Track 1: It's just let them see that there are other things that can happen, for you to have, some peace of mind, right? That doesn't have to resort to that, those extremes, but yeah, that's what they'll come in and say.

[00:32:19] Isn't that what happens here? No, that is not what happens here. You watch way too much

[00:32:24] Ashley: I know,

[00:32:24] Mawiyah: right?

[00:32:26] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: like, you wanna be like, you think I murder

[00:32:28] people?

[00:32:28] Track 1: What am I? The mom,

[00:32:33] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: I know, I was gonna say, it's like, you're like, I'm a mom. Like, I don't kill people. Oh, that is so funny. Don't kill people, but that, yeah.

[00:32:44] Track 1: I'm like no. We were going to talk about, what would help your life, have some peace in it or your children's lives or whatever, how can we work that and also allow this person to move forward with whatever they're doing out of your space[00:33:00]

[00:33:00] or that's what we do.

[00:33:01] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Because that's what we actually want. Yeah, nobody's gonna die. Yeah.

[00:33:05] Track 1: Heads in the bed. None of that.

[00:33:06] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: None of that. We don't do horses. That's the mafia. And that's a whole other situation. You can

[00:33:11] Them. Just go to Brooklyn.

[00:33:12] So because we're going to be talking about Oya a little bit later, we're going to talk about a popular Brazilian dish, which is also common to be a offering to Oya.

[00:33:23] So If you're Brazilian you can scream at the podcast as you listen to it because I'm gonna pronounce it wrong, and I'm sorry I apologize in advance. It's called a Akara Jay a car G a car G. Let's just call it that for now Sounds really good. So they're like fritters So in the filling of this fritter situation, there's you have an onion chili pepper some shrimp Palm oil or olive oil.

[00:33:51] I don't know if you guys have palm oil in Brazil. You probably do salt and ground pepper and then for the the outside or for the filling for the fritter oh for [00:34:00] the fritter part you're going to have black eyed peas, garlic, onions, chili pepper, flour and salt, ground more ground pepper, black pepper and palm oil. So you make this thing by slicing the onions thin then you fry them in the oil And then you put shrimp, you saute the shrimp, then you take that aside, then you make the fritters by draining the black eyed peas, you place them in a food processor, chop it up with onion and garlic, remove the seeds and the white parts from the outside of a chili pepper, and also put that in the processor. Mix everything up, then you heat palm oil again, and you fry the fritters Until they're lightly brown on each side. And then you split them in half and fill them with the onion and shrimp mixture. And then you serve it warm. Apparently this is a popular Brazilian street food. Sounds delicious.

[00:34:51] Everybody gets some. I have to find some. I don't know where there's any Brazilian restaurants around me, but I will find one. Yeah I probably have to go to the city, but that's fine. Anyway, let's [00:35:00] move on. Okay. So That's our dish of the week. And again, we're going to talk about oil a little bit later We had an episode where we talked about the orishas But we're gonna go through every single one eventually because that was an overview and it's not quite enough

[00:35:12] USB PnP Audio Device-1: Hi everybody. And thank you for listening to this show. So. I know, you're wondering what's the big deal about ratings and reviews and why is this woman always talking about them? Here's the thing, when you rate or review any podcasts that you like, it gets more people to listen to it, it gets more recognized.

[00:35:30] It puts it out there. So I am here humbly asking you to please rate and or review the podcast. If you listen to us on apple podcasts, Spotify, literally anything. Just, it takes five seconds.

[00:35:45] USB PnP Audio Device-2: Even if you want to go on my website, which is in the show notes and the link in my bio on any social media page, you will find a page where you can write a review on the website too. So it's completely up to you how you want to [00:36:00] review. It's really easy.

[00:36:01] USB PnP Audio Device-1: It does a lot for the podcast and we really, really appreciate it. Okay, thank you. And continue to enjoy the show.

[00:36:08] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: There's so much to go into so We're going to talk about our tea time.

[00:36:12] So we're going to learn something today. So most people have heard of High John the Conqueror root and John the Conqueror. Now I've heard of like the root, but I didn't know who the hell John the Conqueror was. I was like, I didn't know it was like a person. I just thought that was the name of the herb. So I started to read a little bit about him. So One of the ethnographers so these are people who study different ethnic groups such as a very famously Zora Neale Hurston she said that John the Conqueror was a African slave who was perhaps a real person, but you know like a John Henry character where he was probably real But there was like a lot of enhancements lore around him It was embellished And Some people say, well, it may have all been fictional.

[00:36:58] It doesn't really matter. [00:37:00] One note I want to make when we talk about folklore and folk tales. People say, well, it didn't really happen. It doesn't matter. Honestly, it just doesn't matter. Yeah, like,

[00:37:10] what matters is the influence that those folktales and that folklore have on the people. John the Conqueror was a character, whether he was real or not, who inspired people, who made people feel good, who made people want to persist and keep going. That's why it matters. So I don't care if you come to me and you tell me, Oh, so and so wasn't real. I don't care. Did it make, did it do something for the culture? Did it do something for those people and make them feel good? Yeah who cares? And you think of John the Conqueror, and you think of all the other people, you think of we, we think of Simone Boulevard, and you think

[00:37:47] of what's my man in Haiti?

[00:37:49] Oh my gosh

[00:37:50] I'm

[00:37:50] Track 1: Francois Mackendale, huh? Are you talking about Mackendale?

[00:37:53] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Hey man, who's the guy who liberated Haiti?

[00:37:56] Track 1: oh, yeah, I can't think of it now.

[00:37:59] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: it's okay. I'll [00:38:00] go back and I'll add it because you guys are like screaming at the screen . That's okay. It doesn't matter what it does matter. But what I'm saying is characters like John the Conqueror inspired these people and it when you think of that it helped people get through their day.

[00:38:15] So that's why I

[00:38:16] Track 1: I do too. I do too. And we've always tied it in with Frederick Douglass, right? Meaning Sandy Jenkins in the woods. And so we've, I've worked, the way I've been taught is, the root itself. You hear the story of Frederick Douglass and Sandy Jenkins and using the roots so he could go back when he went back to the plantation, not to have the beatings anymore and to fight for his own right as a man.

[00:38:37] And then we go, my grandfather would always go into the High John the Conqueror roots. story. This African prince is what they said, who asked who kept dreaming of this nightmarish hell that people were going through, who asked his father if he could be transported across the waters. And his father did not want him to.

[00:38:53] His father was a seer as well. And eventually he allowed him to go. And he said, I have to go and liberate the people. [00:39:00] So he gets there and so then we have this whole, this analogy with the devil or Satan who is already there and who is saying, he's collecting all these souls. And because people are, as they are working the plantations, picking cotton and sugar cane and stalking the sugar cane, they're saying, I can't do this, I just would rather die.

[00:39:18] And so when they kill themselves or are asked to be killed or whatever, the devil gets their souls.

[00:39:24] So when John comes to the plantation, he starts to teach the people how to become maroons, how to leave, how to burn things, how to do things. And the devil loses all of these souls, right? And so he's pissed off,

[00:39:36] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah!

[00:39:37] Track 1: he goes to John to try to strike a deal.

[00:39:41] And John says to him, no, I'm, I have a purpose. My purpose is liberation. So the devil goes and says, well, you know what? I know what I'll do. He brings his daughter, who is Lilith, right?

[00:39:51] And so she comes and so the devil says, you're beautiful and everything. You can convince him.

[00:39:55] And so John sees her. She sees John. She falls madly in love. John loves her. But [00:40:00] John's thinking, I still have a job to do.

[00:40:02] And she wants to see and feel compassion for John. And so her compassion for John and what he's doing and the fact that she doesn't believe that these people should be treated this way.

[00:40:11] She says, well, I'll help you. But my father, he's a strong man, he'll come after you. So John decides that he's going to whisper. He sees all these roots, right? He's going to whisper his story into the roots. So the roots start to talk to the other route, right?

[00:40:25] They hop aboard the devil's favorite thoroughbred, and John says, we're going to go back to my homeland, because it's protected, right?

[00:40:33] He can't, your father can't get in there. So when the devil, who was taking a nap, thinking that they're doing his job for him, getting his souls, wakes up and sees that, they're, There are no souls there for him and that the plantation is burning and people are still leaving the plantation. And he hears these roots.

[00:40:48] They're just talking and chanting this story of liberation. He's so angry. He burrows a hole into the ground and is never seen again. And so that's how we understand the story of high John the conqueror. So yeah, like you say, it doesn't [00:41:00] mean it doesn't matter if it's. If he was a real person, the liberation, the energy of it.

[00:41:05] And so we were always taught that a conqueror root always sits at your workings. No matter what, who you're working, you're doing. It always sits there in honor of John and in honor of all of our ancestors.

[00:41:18] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yes! Oh, gosh, I love that! That's so beautiful! Yes! Oh, my gosh, thank you for telling that story because it's like,

[00:41:27] I didn't even have, yeah, I didn't even have that story. That was a good ass story. Yeah! I

[00:41:32] Track 1: I always love that one. My grandfather, when he would say, who wants to? My brother would be like, I want to go play football. My sister's like, I want to get on the phone. I was like,

[00:41:39] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: like to

[00:41:41] Track 1: you heard that story 50

[00:41:43] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: loved it.

[00:41:45] Track 1: Right,

[00:41:46] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yes. Oh my gosh. Yes. So that is a background of John the conqueror.

[00:41:52] And he also is sometimes seen as like a Okay, so trickster. I hate when people use trickster as a bad [00:42:00] thing. Tricksters are not bad. Tricksters are just smart. Like, and yeah, and Nancy is my homeboy, my love. He is this, he's a trickster. And Nancy wasn't like evil. He just like, was like, I'm tired.

[00:42:11] I wanna do everything quick, like . So

[00:42:13] yeah. Yes.

[00:42:14] Track 1: And we have

[00:42:15] them in our families, right? They come over for holidays. The trickster. But at the end of the day, you're back in love with them,

[00:42:22] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Exactly! You love them because you're like, they're like that lovable scamp. You're like, ah,

[00:42:26] Track 1: Yeah.

[00:42:26] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: everything, but it's fine. We love

[00:42:28] you.

[00:42:30] Track 1: See you next holiday.

[00:42:33] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: That's how he was seen

[00:42:34] because he was outwitting the masters, he's outwitting the plantation owners and that kind

[00:42:38] of thing and

[00:42:39] helping the slaves do little things to make their lives easier, to help them escape and all that kind of stuff.

[00:42:44] So he

[00:42:45] was

[00:42:45] Track 1: I like that he always allowed them to, even though he was there, to give them that help to see that you still have to do some work, too. And a lot of the stories that Zora Neale Hurston, who I love she always talks about as far as, they had to see their way.

[00:42:58] They had to see a [00:43:00] way, and he couldn't just do it all, but he brought you there. My father would say, you can bring a horse to water, but you can't make him drink, and so that is the thing, and so that's what he did for them. He brought them there, but they had to figure it out, and so you always had people who Who didn't want to run like what Harriet Tubman, with the gun, you're going to get up and move, but you had people who were like I'd rather just stay here.

[00:43:18] They didn't want to take that chance. And so High John and Cockroach allows us to take that chance. And even today with our magic, with this working, with who do you still have people who go, I don't want any part of that, they, and they have that. John gives us that, you can accept it and come on into the fold, or you can stay over there and do what you've been doing.

[00:43:36] And hopefully it works for you.

[00:43:37] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Absolutely, and that is so important because especially in the cases like with slavery in the

[00:43:43] Americas

[00:43:44] Track 1: Huh. Huh.

[00:43:44] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: The slaves had not been given agency over their own bodies. So For John to come and say like, I'm here to liberate you, but it's up to you. Like you do what you want. And also when I'm trying to help you, this is what you are going to do to help yourself because it's because they needed to [00:44:00] be like, Oh yeah, I am still completely in charge of myself and my own body and I am a full person and I can do what I want.

[00:44:06] So I love how. That comes into it because it's so important to show like that. These people were more than just people who needed to be freed. They were smart, intelligent people on their own, right? And they could do everything they need to do, and he saw that in them. And that's beautiful. So one thing that I love that said when he bet he never lost he would sometimes play dumb but he wasn't outsmarted. He would play dumb because he wanted people to think he was dumb, but he wasn't, he was really smart. I'm like, yeah, so he'd be like, I don't know, but it was just to get over on people so he could get out of whatever he needs to do. And the words John over John or John the Conqueror are super, they're in itself, those words are a powerful protection spell for people. So the route, just like, Mawiyo just explained, it's a route that a lot of workers will put in their altar or in front of all their workings because Like you said, it's honoring [00:45:00] John. The fresh John the Conqueror root has a unique spicy fragrance and it's reminiscent of like a cherry scented pipe tobacco cedarwood, cinnamon, allspice, nutmeg. Ooh, I love that smell. Also, so be careful cause if you. Don't ingest it because it'll make you poop a lot. So don't do that. Yeah Don't do that Instead carry it around Unless you're having trouble I guess but like be careful.

[00:45:31] Exactly instead put it in your pocket put it in your mojo bag put it on your altar. A lot of people bring it to games where they're gambling or you know doing something for fun like that or It also said to enhance personal sexual power.

[00:45:45] Track 1: Because of its shape too. Yeah, because it's shaped like the male scrotum. So yeah, so usually people will say, yeah, they will definitely, they'll rub it with a little oil and they'll keep it in their bedroom or put it under their, the the mattress in the box spring, put it in between there to bring that, enhance [00:46:00] that sexual energy.

[00:46:01] Yeah.

[00:46:01] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Nice. Yeah. Okay. You guys got a little tip there. Everyone's running out to buy right now.

[00:46:10] Track 1: There you go! I'm

[00:46:14] going to film them! Yeah, they're like

[00:46:17] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: There's, it's used to draw money towards you, and I put a link in the in the show notes where you can see a lot of the really specific ways to do it. Also get Conjuring the Calabash because there's tons of other ways to do stuff in there too. And there's also people do a lot of work with the root and they use Psalm 23, which is the Lord is my

[00:46:37] shepherd, I shall not want that one. The Psalms, we all know I have to do a whole episode on Psalms

[00:46:42] because the Psalms, yeah,

[00:46:43] Track 1: just, magic. It's just witchcraft all the

[00:46:45] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: just witchcraft in the Bible, everybody, if you didn't

[00:46:48] Track 1: The whole book, right?

[00:46:50] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: like,

[00:46:51] it's Basically, I know,

[00:46:53] like, so it's great. So a lot of people say that it's good to do workings with High John the Conqueror [00:47:00] Root during a waxing moon phase. But you can do it any time that you want. But that's just, a little tidbit. If

[00:47:05] you want to do

[00:47:06] it during that, if you're into moon stuff you can use the oil, if you get like the hoodoo oil that people make you can be used to dress your bath, to dress a candle.

[00:47:16] Track 1: Can I say something?

[00:47:17] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Absolutely.

[00:47:18] Track 1: Yeah. Or you, if a lot of times if you don't have the chance to get to the oil, I often use like olive oil. I'll put olive oil in the jar and I'll put a root in there and I'll let it sit in there for about a couple of weeks. And I will use that oil as my Hygienic Conqueror oil.

[00:47:31] This is just a quick tip in case you don't want to go out and buy the oil or you can't get to it. You can do that as well.

[00:47:36] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Oh good tip everybody you guys got a little olive oil you can spare but got it I got mine's from aldi's the other day. So yeah that thank you. That's super good. Now you.

[00:47:45] got another tidbit. There's all sorts of prep ways people may get some people there You can find incense powders if you like whichever way you like But that's a really good way that malia just said like if you want to dress a candle with it Get your olive oil soak it for a couple weeks [00:48:00] and you can dress a candle or whatever you'd like You can even Use it.

[00:48:04] Well, it's if it's an oil probably don't want to use it too much in your clothes But there's a little bit if you make like a water with it. I think there's a way I don't know the way but I'll put it on the show notes You can make a water that you can put it in your laundry or whatnot and when you clean up and always tell people when you clean up any Incense or anything either you wanna Depending on what you did.

[00:48:29] I like to put stuff in my backyard if you have a little grassy area to put it Somewhere like in kids somewhere that people aren't gonna go You don't have if you want to throw it in the garbage, that's fine I like to put stuff outside because I just feel better as long it's biodegradable obviously, but It's still gonna work But don't always just throw stuff in the garbage.

[00:48:51] I don't know. It makes me nervous. Everyone's different. Yeah, but like, depending on If it's something like you're doing a magical working where you're like trying to get rid of something then you [00:49:00] can throw the garbage

[00:49:01] But if it's something that you're trying to manifest, sometimes I would put it in your backyard or maybe not your backyard, but somewhere in like an area where there's grass that

[00:49:09] nobody's going to go digging around and talking to it,

[00:49:12] That's what I would say.

[00:49:13] That's a little bit about their route. Again, there's there's way more specific stuff in this link that I put in the bio, so you can check all of that out. Okay, and we'll go to our story time next because I want to talk about Oya. Maoya is very familiar with Oya. So all of you, we're going to talk about her.

[00:49:34] We talked about the Orishas before, but like I said, there's so much going on with the Orishas that like one episode about all of them is like, So we're always going to like go back and forth and we'll talk about different ones, throughout the time that this podcast is on. So today we'll talk about Oya.

[00:49:51] So Oya is awesome. And she is the Aresha of the wind, storms, hurricanes, [00:50:00] and the Aresha of the cemetery. So she also presides over healings and mediumships, any type of div bleh. divination dealing with The dead she presides over that she's actually which I thought was funny while I was like doing my research she's like the only orisha that was like i'll deal with the dead because everyone else was like I don't really want to talk She was the one who's like, oh, okay i'll do it i gotta do everything around here

[00:50:27] Track 1: There's a story that goes I heard this a long time ago by an older Oya priestess. And she was saying how Yemanja had the cemetery and Oya had the waters. And so Yemanja was Oh, can watch the cemetery for me? I need to go and make a run, like that.

[00:50:41] And Oya was like, Okay, yeah, girl, I'll do it, and so she doesn't come back. And so finally Like where is she, and after nine nights, she's waiting and she's like, basically like, ha, you got it, it was like, it was she was like, so some people will say she was tricked into having the cemetery, but she made the best [00:51:00] of it.

[00:51:00] And I thought, oh my goodness, that's, she's like, yeah, her girlfriend tricked her. I was like, oh no, that's a girlfriend. But yeah, so go ahead. I just wanted to put that one in there.

[00:51:11] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: That's

[00:51:11] One thing I love whenever and because anybody I know like I Like this story you just told me all the stories I hear about the Orishas from different people who practice Santeria or IFA or not. I always hear different stories and I love them. Number one, they're the best because the Orishas are just like hilarious sometimes.

[00:51:31] Like they were just like, they trick each other. They're like

[00:51:35] mad. Yeah. They love each other, but then they're mad at each other, but then they're actually fine. Like they're the two. Yeah. Out of all, like out of a lot of the Pantheons in the world, I feel like they're one of the. Most like relatable like people

[00:51:50] Track 1: And I think that, from all of my study and my workings with them, I think that a lot of it is, it's supposed to be that way. They're not supposed to be so omnipotent and, [00:52:00] unaccessible that we just,

[00:52:00] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah

[00:52:01] Track 1: of thing. They're supposed to be like us and have our follies and do all the things that we do and we get upset and we like things and whatever.

[00:52:08] They go through those same things and that makes them easy to relate to.

[00:52:12] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Absolutely, yes, that's why they're hilarious and they're amazing and it's like humans But they all just have like magical powers and they

[00:52:20] So when they get mad they get like real mad And

[00:52:27] Track 1: It's not like us. We're just wishing we could do something about it. They're like, oh yeah, I got you. Ha.

[00:52:33] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: I love it. So in Venezuela, she rules over justice and memory. She's often invoked for fertility, especially after a miscarriage, so like a rainbow baby. She's the mother of Abiku, which is the child that is born to die, A lot of her followers some of them don't eat mutton and there's like a story about that. I'll tell you in a sec She also can she [00:53:00] cannot be worshipped so on an altar Now, everybody, if you know the Orishas, you know that there's a lot of some people don't get along with this one and they don't get along with this one.

[00:53:10] So you can't put them all together. So here's the thing. With Oshun and Oya, to me, in my head, They don't hate each other, but they're just not like friends So you don't want to put them next to each other on an altar cuz yeah, they're not cool like that and the reason is let me tell you the tea.

[00:53:26] So what happened was Okay, if you also know the Orishas this one's married to this one, but this one started Friends with benefits with this one. It's a whole situation. So what happened was apparently And it's so funny because sometimes timelines, there's no timelines, they're gods. But anyway, okay. So this is a story. One time Oya was a buffalo because she's a goddess and she could do whatever she wants. So she was a buffalo. And then Ogun was in the forest. Ogun is the guy who's always working. He's the god of work and iron. He's always working. He saw [00:54:00] her and He saw the buffalo. He's like, Oh, what a nice looking buffalo.

[00:54:03] And then she turned into this beautiful woman. Oh, yeah. And he was like, Oh my God, she's so hot. So he followed. Oh, yeah, she was walking through the forest and she goes into the market and she's buying stuff. And he walks up to her and he's like, Hey, and she's like, hello. And he's like, I got to marry you.

[00:54:17] And she's like, what? He's like, I just saw you were a buffalo. And she's like. What? And so she realizes that he saw her and he's like, please marry me. Oh my gosh. You're the most beautiful woman. And like, you were a Buffalo and that's really awesome. Please marry me. And she's like, okay, fine. I'll marry you, but you can never tell anybody I was a Buffalo. And he's like, fine, no problem. Just marry me. So she marries him. Everything's fine, except it's not because they go home and Ogun's already got some wives. So when they realize how much Ogun likes Oya, they're all annoyed and they don't like her. And they're like, there's something about Oya that we don't like.

[00:54:51] They can't put their finger on it, but they don't like her. So finally, so I've heard this story two different ways. Either, and that's the beauty of folklore also, you'll hear this story five [00:55:00] different ways. Either Oya and Ogun got in a fight and he brought up the fact like, Well, you are a buffalo, like who knows? Or I heard the story that his other wives got him drunk. And then while they was drunk, drunk mouths, sober, true situation.

[00:55:15] They asked yeah, they were like, so what's the situation with Oya? Why do we all think she's weird? And he's like, Oh, because sometimes she's a buffalo. So

[00:55:22] then Oya, yeah, heard.

[00:55:24] And she's like, Oh no, I told you not to tell anybody. And she goes, and then she goes and stays a buffalo and leaves Ogun. And he's sad about it, obviously. But I also heard. Okay, the other thing is, Ogun's brother is Shango, and I heard that Oya may also have left Ogun because she got tired of going to work with him. She was like, you're so boring. How will you do his work? And Shango is like a little more, at least to me, he's a little more flashy, a little bit more like the kind of guy who's like gonna like romance you and [00:56:00] show you a little good time. Ogun, it's not like he's a bad guy. He's just is really interested in working and working hard. Yeah, so she's like, no, your brother's way more fun. I'm gonna go marry him and hang out with him. So that's also part of what had me happen. Now, the whole situation with Oshun is that Oshun was also married to Shango. And Oya is really smart and really, like, tactically good. So when it comes to war and stuff, she's on it. Oshun is like, the one who's also really smart, but she's a really good cook, and Shango really likes that. He really likes her for that, and she is sometimes seen as Shango's favorite wife, so Oya didn't like that either.

[00:56:41] Even though, sometimes, Oshun is sleeping with Ogun on the side! It's crazy! Oh,

[00:56:48] Track 1: It really is. It really is. And another story about the argument between the two is that they were preparing, they were going to prepare a food for Xiong'o and then another wife was going to come in, Yehua. She was going to come in. [00:57:00] And they convince her and they go back and forth. Oshun and Oyaz will go back and forth.

[00:57:04] No, you your mama said it, your mama told

[00:57:06] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah.

[00:57:07] Track 1: somebody convinced Yehua to cut off her ear and to serve it in person. Food, and that he's gonna really fall in love with you if you do that, and so she does that and brings it to him, and he sees that, it's. And he's like, who did this?

[00:57:21] And so he like banishes her from his castle and they're arguing. And so she's saying, but he said, no, she said it. And so there was this big argument. So they just go there separately. He doesn't manage them. They just go to their separate corners and they're like mad at each other because of it.

[00:57:34] But.

[00:57:35] To people who are children of Yehweh, they always carry, have their head covered, make sure their ears are covered in that, in honor of her having lost an ear. And yeah find that a lot of daughters of Oyah and daughters of Oshun, when they get together, they will bring up the ear story.

[00:57:51] Especially in the presence of a Shongol priest,

[00:57:54] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah.

[00:57:55] Track 1: Like you're the one who did that. You did that, that kind of thing. But because she is [00:58:00] when we have hurricanes and thunderstorms and tornadoes she's the one who rides alongside Shango. She is considered this great beauty, this wonderful She just does these things.

[00:58:10] She can have all these men. She has this power as, as much as a man that's bigger, as much as a man, which always, oftentimes obsessed the other ladies, because it's like, you can be ladylike, but you can also do that. But we just have to, we're just more ladylike than you are in those times. And I know for myself as a, as an Oya priest, we have to When there are storms, we have to make sure that we cover our windows and close our shutters and things like that.

[00:58:34] We're not to look into our mother's face when

[00:58:37] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Okay.

[00:58:37] Track 1: composing her destruction. So yeah, so that's what happened. So yeah, but I loved all those stories. I, you know what? I love the stories and I love the way you told me because that's the way I always think of them as it's like, let me tell you, and my kids, when they were coming up in, in the recent culture, they love the stories too.

[00:58:54] They were like, Oh, look at this one and that one. Cause I would buy all these books. And there's this one [00:59:00] guy Ochani Lili, he writes these books and his stories are always, So just like that, let me tell you, kind of thing. And we would read them in the mornings, we would have a development hour and the kids would love that, they would fall out laughing, at the fact that how these how they just act like us, they get mad, but they can do something about it, that kind of

[00:59:19] thing, and, Ogun, when you were talking about her being the Buffalo, there's another, Story the same way on the same line where he removed the skins.

[00:59:29] She would put our buffalo skins in the tree, seal the tree up and go into market. And he removed the skins so that she would say she would marry him. And he said that he was going to hide the skins. And the women, when he got drunk, he was saying where the skins were. They went and found them and they were like, you're a buffalo, kind of thing.

[00:59:44] And she was like, oh my God, I told you, yeah. So yeah, I love those. I love them

[00:59:49] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: I know.

[00:59:50] Track 1: just shows how human they are, and how we, we do the same, a lot of the same things, we trust people that we shouldn't, we have all these relationships with people that [01:00:00] maybe we shouldn't, maybe we should find somebody who's more compatible to us.

[01:00:03] We think we want the workaholic, but do we really? We want the fun guy, is the fun guy good enough for us though? I don't know. As a fun girl. And so we understand how how all of that just works together. And so forth. Yeah. Yeah. I appreciate those stories.

[01:00:18] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: I know me too and this is like side note because it's another story that I absolutely love is when so Ogun just like was in the forest working and everything else stopped working because he wouldn't go into the world and help people work.

[01:00:32] So like, I'm not telling the story as accurate as it really is, but just stay with me, everybody.

[01:00:37] So he like was in the forest working with himself and everyone's like, we need you to come back to the world. And he's like, no, thank you. So he's in there. So Oshun was like, okay, no problem. I know what to do. Oshun, AKA like the sensual goddess here. Okay, so she's just like no problem.

[01:00:51] Hold on I'm gonna go in there and like look hot and shake it and that's what she did She

[01:00:57] just went in the forest and she's [01:01:00] like, hey, oh good and he's like, oh, wow, you look really hot She's like, I know don't you want to come out the forest and he

[01:01:06] Track 1: Yep, that's it. That's that story.

[01:01:08] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: And then

[01:01:08] Track 1: drinking,

[01:01:08] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: it. Yeah, she covered herself in honey and

[01:01:13] walked around and he

[01:01:14] was like, okay, no problem I

[01:01:18] Track 1: problem. Ha. More ways than one. Yeah.

[01:01:21] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: the orishas are so funny so Sorry, everybody. I just really like that story always makes me laugh. So also, Oya really loves librarians. She loves, Oh, she's also, we talked about her going to the market.

[01:01:33] She's also the goddess of the market and market women, especially a lot of market women have alters to Oya because that's her domain. Female warriors, like Mawiya was just talking about. She rides into battle with Shango. Cemetery workers and, morticians also because she rules the cemetery. She can be a woman, she can be a buffalo, she usually wears nine copper bracelets. Each of the Orishas kind of have a number. Hers is nine, Oshun [01:02:00] is five and I forget the others, but I just know those two. So then her color is maroon or purple. Like a dark red. Sometimes her day is on Thursday. She loves copper. That's why she's got copper bracelets on. She loves antelopes, sheep, locusts, as well as the Buffalo. Her plants include camphor, cypress mimosa, which I don't know what that is, but it sounds cool. And marigolds. And she, like I said before, she's the only Well, now we know she may have been tricked.

[01:02:29] She was tricked into dealing with the dead, but she's the only one who's dealing with the dead. She likes purple fruits, also like plums,

[01:02:36] red grapes, and her favorite plant, favorite vegetable is eggplant.

[01:02:42] So if you're looking to. Learn more about Oya. Know that she's a purple girl. I'm a purple girl.

[01:02:47] I love purple.

[01:02:48] Oshun ended up being the one who talks to me a lot. I love you, Oshun. Oya is, but Oya is equally as awesome. They're both great. They just are on different sides of stuff. Anyway, that's it. So that's [01:03:00] about Oya. So now you know more about The Arisha who deals with the hurricanes and the wind and thank you.

[01:03:05] That's so interesting. Malia that about not looking into your mother's face and I feel like that's a lot of religions and spiritual paths have that kind of tradition. Like you

[01:03:14] don't look directly. It makes sense, right? Like they're this

[01:03:17] It's a respect

[01:03:18] Track 1: to see, I want to see, no.

[01:03:19] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah. Also, I'm terrified

[01:03:23] Track 1: No, I will not look.

[01:03:24] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah, in the most beautiful and loving way, we're

[01:03:27] terrified. Yeah.

[01:03:30] Track 1: We're so proud of your beauty,

[01:03:31] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yeah, your beauty and your intelligence, we're terrified, but we love you. Thank you. Oh, gosh. Okay. So that brings us to the end of this show. Maui,

[01:03:44] Track 1: Been so much fun. I feel like I could just hang out with you, like,

[01:03:48] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: been such a good time!

[01:03:53] Track 1: were just hanging out. We weren't even taping. Like, what? Like, you know what? This is so much fun. Okay, yes, but go ahead.[01:04:00]

[01:04:00] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: No, it's fine. Thank you. I'm so happy because I feel the same way. This has been such a good time. Can you let us know where people can find you and anything you want to tell us about how people can hear more of your awesomeness?

[01:04:12] Track 1: Well, definitely. My my web page, my way of Kyle to my Bomani, that's the quickest way to find me. I'm also on all the social media platforms with the same thing, my way of Bomani. And yeah, that's the way they can find me. I'm always on there posting pictures or talking about something.

[01:04:26] I don't post ultra pictures because I don't have that kind of time. I'm constantly changing things around. I see people do that and I go, Oh man, they got a lot of time on their hands. But but yeah, I try to talk a lot about who do, or, whatever's going on as far as our community, black and brown people fight a lot for, I talk a lot about the LGBTQ community.

[01:04:46] I have two queer daughters and so I love them to pieces, so I'm fighting for them all the time. And I'm just doing my thing, trying to make it a fair and equal world for all of us. Cause I love all people. I just want us to love each other. You know what I'm saying?

[01:04:59] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Yes, that's [01:05:00] awesome and as always all of Maui's Links will be all in the show notes and you'll be able to link them real quick if you want to check it out and Your book is everywhere. So you can get the book anywhere. It's awesome. I love how you, I just love how you show up for the black and brown community and the LGBTQ community.

[01:05:23] It's just really beautiful. So thank you.

[01:05:25] Track 1: Thank you. There

[01:05:26] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: Of course. Okay everybody. So thank you all for celebrating with us and hanging out because I feel like this was a party for coming! Oh my god! Thank you!

[01:05:37] Track 1: Take your party papers with you.

[01:05:39] ashley---she-her-_1_02-18-2024_130743: This is This is Dive with the Divine we're on all the socials, Instagram, threads, Facebook, YouTube, and if you like the show, if you don't mind pausing and giving us a reading, five stars is always preferable, but whatever you say it with your chest, and if you have any chest questions, Comments constructive [01:06:00] critiques or anything you want to tell me feel free You can email me at time with the divine pot at gmail.

[01:06:04] com And if you want to follow me Ashley, I'm at Sankofa HS. That's s a n k o f a h s On Instagram and all those other platforms or Sankofa healing sanctuary on Facebook. So thank you all so much for coming Thank you. Maui. I again and Yes, I'll see you guys next week. Bye

[01:06:25] ​